Re: XMMS Lunacy

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On Mon, 2002-09-02 at 14:22, John Spellman wrote:
> Also, where is the note saying: 'Redhat's XMMS does
> not play MP3s anymore', so I don't go through the
> trouble of checking all my connections and testing
> other sounds and programs?  This is as bad as
> Microsoft (though I loathe to make the comparison)
> pushing users toward their own preferred format, with
> no regard for the vast usage of MP3s among users.

This is a beta....bugs in the notes are to be expect too.....I'm sure
the mp3 issue will be written up in the release notes before the next
release...and I'm sure the mp3 licensing issues are noted in the rpm
changlogs package by package.  The changelog for the xmms package
definitely says the mpg123 plugin was taken out.  This is a developing
issue.....


> 
> If Redhat wishes to avoid a potential license change
> that MAY OR MAY NOT take place in the future, then it
> should at least support MP3 until devices and
> CD-players and stereo systems support Ogg.

Nope...there is an open question as to whether the GPL mp3 decoders are
in violation of the GPL becuase of the patent licensing terms...Its in
Redhat's best interest to avoid any liability by removing mp3s as soon
as they THINK there MIGHT be a licensing conflict....or thomson can sue
them for damages for all the code they have released.  Hell even Sun has
pulled mp3 decoder code from the Java Media Framework downloads...this
is not a non-issue. The Java stuff doesn't even have the extra
complicated GPL issue to sort out.  Sun's probably gut the legal guns to
take on thomson in a court fight...and even they are be prudent and
removing the code for now.  Its the prudent and responsible thing to
do.  This is still a BETA product...give Redhat the benefit of the doubt
on this and give them a little time to sort this out. I'm sure if the
mp3 issue doesnt get sorted by the time the release date for the next
release you will see some explanation in the release notes...if not on
redhat's website itself.  

> 
> Not a good sign going into Red Hat's first desktop
> offering. Dumping MP3 support is not the way into
> mainstream users' hearts.

Can't be helped...if the code is in violation of the GPL....redhat can't
redistribute it...its thomson's and the xmms projects fault.  Thomson
should have be very clear about what was allowed...and the xmms project
should have demanded that thomson be very clear about what they allow. 
Redhat stuck in the middle...not much they can do about it if there is a
GPL violation thanks to the patent clause.  Why dont you write to
Thomson about the issue...or the xmms developers.  Its understandable to
be upset...but this is a developing issue...one Redhat has very little
control over.  I'm quite confident that if Thomson's intent to charge
for decoders was made clear at the inception of the xmms project/mpg123
projects...mp3 enabled xmms would never have been picked up and included
in the commercial distros.  So think of the last couple of years of mp3
usage as a nice free trial...sort of like the free HBO and showtime
weekends you get sometimes on cable.  It was nice to have it when it was
free....but now thats the free trial is over...i really don't think its
worth paying for.

> 
> (P.S. If you look at the properties under XMMS, it is
> called a Media Player, and the first thing it claims
> to play is MP3).

You can still get the mp3 playing bits yourself...Redhat just can't
redistribute them...so yes xmms is a media player...it can play
mp3s....you just need the plugins...which redhat can't distribute.  In
fact there are several extra plugins for xmms that you normally don't
get becuase you have to pay for them...so nice output plugins...the mp3
plugin will now fall in that category unfortunately.

-jef



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